so it's now a part of Scientology's "mythology"?

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AthlAnon 88

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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 4:44 am

so it's now a part of Scientology's "mythology"?

I felt this was a more appropriate place to ask than over at my Anon-turf of Enturbulation since Anonymous' stance (if we really even have a stance of anything other than our mantra and "we're not your personal army") is, understandably, "we really don't care about Xenu. There are bigger things at stake."

One of the local rags near my neck of the woods ran a fluff piece on Scientology. It's apparently going to be a two part story, this being the first half. What's interesting with this piece comes from the Atlanta org's head and mouthpiece, Deb Danos, who, to some degree, actually doesn't flat out deny OTIII's Space Opera... albeit it's seriously downplayed.

Danos, for her part, openly acknowledges the existence of the Xenu story but says it is often "taken out of context."

"I've been in Scientology quite a long time," she said, "and (that story) has always been of interest to individuals who want to make everything about Scientology seem bizarre and unusual."

Danos added that, as far as she's seen, the story is by no means central to the tenets of Hubbard, labeling it "mythology" akin to the parables found in the book of Genesis.

She said the Biblical account of the Immaculate Conception could be made to sound just as ludicrous, if filtered through the mouth of someone who sought to heap ridicule on Christianity.


Don't get me wrong, I can find more holes and arguments against Danos' words than I could in most paragraphs of LRH's official biography, but it really surprised me that she flat out admitted Xenu in some shape or form after a long history of Scientologists denying any mention of the space opera in doctrine. You know, despite the fact it was released to the public in court.

So is this the new official Co$ statement on Xenu? Are they now officially taking the whole "It's not any dumber than anything other religious scripture's story" stance on the subject? (and sorry to quote South Park, but all things considered "Yes, that is WAY more retarded.")

The reason I bring this up is because some of us have been looking for more bullet points against the actual org where we'll be 3/15 rather than just Scientology as a whole, since we have a few catalogs worth of crimes to pin on the whole damn machine (most of which are touched on here at Ex-Scn Kids). We're looking to point out to Georgians how they could be effected especially with all the front groups, and also how bogus they are. I'm hoping I'm on to something with this one, as I myself think bringing up Xenu is passe, especially when there are a lot more harmful practices here than buying into stories about space alien overlords flying DC-8's in space. But even a little discredit should amount to something.

We've already caught 'em in a few lies they've pumped out, and some anons are planning a second March protest at the Georgia capital when some Narconon guys plan on pushing their poison there. So I thought maybe one of you guys may have something on this whole new semi-acceptance of Xenu. Is this becoming more widespread post-"Trapped In A Closet" for more Co$ mouthpieces to half-ass admit what we've already known even before Matt and Trey released it upon the masses that never cared enough to look it up themselves, or is Danos treading on thin ice with the "church" for even commenting on X-E-M-U?

And sorry if my words read as clear as mud. I just took my nightly entheta doomsday pills, and have a hard time proofreading my ramblings.
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Scarf

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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 7:25 am

IMHO, we shouldn't really go after Xenu. People are free to believe what they want, no matter how nutty, but- they're not free to perform whatever abuse they damn well please on others, no matter what they believe about it. And there's no justifying the years of it when it's written right in Hubbard's own policy letters!

Also, she's completely off about the Immaculate Conception. It's not described in a story in the Bible. The Catholic Church infers it from the language of the angel Gabriel's greeting to Mary. Sounds like someone's Volunteer Minister hat needs to be worn on someone else's head. What levels has she completed anyway?
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AthlAnon 88

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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:39 pm

Scarf wrote:IMHO, we shouldn't really go after Xenu. People are free to believe what they want, no matter how nutty


I'm hoping I'm on to something with this one, as I myself think bringing up Xenu is passe, especially when there are a lot more harmful practices here than buying into stories about space alien overlords flying DC-8's in space. But even a little discredit should amount to something.


I didn't mean bringing up Xenu as in "LOL Xenu", I meant her downplaying it as "mythos" when it's a part of the whole "Wall of Fire" everyone makes a big deal out of. That what I meant by "a little discredit".

As far as how far she is in the moneytrap, I have no clue. Considering she called us "squirrels" when not one Freezoner was on our side of the picket line...
Last edited by AthlAnon 88 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:41 pm

Don't get me wrong, I can find more holes and arguments against Danos' words than I could in most paragraphs of LRH's official biography, but it really surprised me that she flat out admitted Xenu in some shape or form after a long history of Scientologists denying any mention of the space opera in doctrine. You know, despite the fact it was released to the public in court.


This may well be the new stance, but I'll place my bets on the fact that Danos is in ethics right this very second.

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AthlAnon 88

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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:43 pm

Tru2form wrote:I'll place my bets on the fact that Danos is in ethics right this very second.


You know, somehow, I was thinking "Somebody's heading to ethics" myself...
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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:45 pm

...which is sad, really, because it's quite a clever response to the "Xenu is stupid" comments.

For the time being, I recommend bookmarking this article as the perfect thing to show Scientologists.
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Orderous

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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 1:32 pm

For the past two weeks or so, every article I've read where a Scientologist makes a statement, there is some part of it where I start thinking; "He/She is going to have a bad day tomorrow."

Perfect example is the article from Dagbladet, where the PR person for the Oslo org made a comment along the lines of; "If it [Fair Game policy] had still existed he would be six feet under" (Directed at Andreas Heldal-Lund).

Seemingly one out of two things will happen;

1) One of the lesser org spokespeople crack completely in an interview and start confirming everything that has been claimed by critics
2) The CoS puts a complete ban on making any statments whatsoever

2 seems more likely than 1, but then again this could be interpreted as a defensive move, which is strictly against policy.

Time to squirrel some more tech DM?
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AthlAnon 88

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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 5:07 pm

Tru2form wrote:For the time being, I recommend bookmarking this article as the perfect thing to show Scientologists.


To any rank of Scientologist, or specifically Pre-Clears/Below OTIII Clears? I think some of the ATL guys are printing it out.
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Tru2form

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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 5:21 pm

Both. The younger, because they don't know, and there's a fairly even-handed Scn article with a Scientologist stating that it's true.

The ones who are above OTIII, to tell them they can stop freakin' denying it now.
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NarkAnon

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Post Wed Mar 05, 2008 11:37 pm

I've always been amazed that the "Incident II" story hasn't ended up being omitted or modified long before now simply for PR reasons. Obviously that would violate "Source", but since no one's allowed to discuss it anyway, how would anyone find out?

Perhaps that's one more thing Miscavige intends to do as he systematically squirrels...oops, I mean "corrects" the tech. :wink:
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Tru2form

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Post Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:33 am

NarkAnon wrote:I've always been amazed that the "Incident II" story hasn't ended up being omitted or modified long before now simply for PR reasons. Obviously that would violate "Source", but since no one's allowed to discuss it anyway, how would anyone find out?

Perhaps that's one more thing Miscavige intends to do as he systematically squirrels...oops, I mean "corrects" the tech. :wink:


Insider reports indicate you may be more right that you know on this one.
:|
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Holden Caulfield

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Post Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:28 pm

Tru2form wrote:
NarkAnon wrote:I've always been amazed that the "Incident II" story hasn't ended up being omitted or modified long before now simply for PR reasons. Obviously that would violate "Source", but since no one's allowed to discuss it anyway, how would anyone find out?

Perhaps that's one more thing Miscavige intends to do as he systematically squirrels...oops, I mean "corrects" the tech. :wink:


Insider reports indicate you may be more right that you know on this one.
:|


Care to elaborate on that a bit more?
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Anonerly

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Post Tue Mar 11, 2008 10:46 pm

If they admit this, then it won't be long before they start admitting other things. If we keep up the pressure the dam will have to break, sooner or later.

Ah democracy. No matter how you spin it and no matter how bad things get, the voice of the people still rules supreme.
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Tru2form

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Post Tue Mar 11, 2008 11:20 pm

Holden Caulfield wrote:
Tru2form wrote:
NarkAnon wrote:I've always been amazed that the "Incident II" story hasn't ended up being omitted or modified long before now simply for PR reasons. Obviously that would violate "Source", but since no one's allowed to discuss it anyway, how would anyone find out?

Perhaps that's one more thing Miscavige intends to do as he systematically squirrels...oops, I mean "corrects" the tech. :wink:


Insider reports indicate you may be more right that you know on this one.
:|


Care to elaborate on that a bit more?


Not on the boards, though it was rather interesting. Problem with "reports from the inside" is that half of them are gold, and half of them are total BS. I'm trying to keep this board as conspiracy-theory free as possible. PM me if you're dying to know, though.
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alex

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Post Sat Mar 15, 2008 3:54 am

Re: so it's now a part of Scientology's "mythology"

AthlAnon 88 wrote:I felt this was a more appropriate place to ask than over at my Anon-turf of Enturbulation since Anonymous' stance (if we really even have a stance of anything other than our mantra and "we're not your personal army") is, understandably, "we really don't care about Xenu. There are bigger things at stake."

One of the local rags near my neck of the woods ran a fluff piece on Scientology. It's apparently going to be a two part story, this being the first half. What's interesting with this piece comes from the Atlanta org's head and mouthpiece, Deb Danos, who, to some degree, actually doesn't flat out deny OTIII's Space Opera... albeit it's seriously downplayed.

Danos, for her part, openly acknowledges the existence of the Xenu story but says it is often "taken out of context."

"I've been in Scientology quite a long time," she said, "and (that story) has always been of interest to individuals who want to make everything about Scientology seem bizarre and unusual."

Danos added that, as far as she's seen, the story is by no means central to the tenets of Hubbard, labeling it "mythology" akin to the parables found in the book of Genesis.

She said the Biblical account of the Immaculate Conception could be made to sound just as ludicrous, if filtered through the mouth of someone who sought to heap ridicule on Christianity.


Don't get me wrong, I can find more holes and arguments against Danos' words than I could in most paragraphs of LRH's official biography, but it really surprised me that she flat out admitted Xenu in some shape or form after a long history of Scientologists denying any mention of the space opera in doctrine. You know, despite the fact it was released to the public in court.

So is this the new official Co$ statement on Xenu? Are they now officially taking the whole "It's not any dumber than anything other religious scripture's story" stance on the subject? (and sorry to quote South Park, but all things considered "Yes, that is WAY more retarded.")

The reason I bring this up is because some of us have been looking for more bullet points against the actual org where we'll be 3/15 rather than just Scientology as a whole, since we have a few catalogs worth of crimes to pin on the whole damn machine (most of which are touched on here at Ex-Scn Kids). We're looking to point out to Georgians how they could be effected especially with all the front groups, and also how bogus they are. I'm hoping I'm on to something with this one, as I myself think bringing up Xenu is passe, especially when there are a lot more harmful practices here than buying into stories about space alien overlords flying DC-8's in space. But even a little discredit should amount to something.

We've already caught 'em in a few lies they've pumped out, and some anons are planning a second March protest at the Georgia capital when some Narconon guys plan on pushing their poison there. So I thought maybe one of you guys may have something on this whole new semi-acceptance of Xenu. Is this becoming more widespread post-"Trapped In A Closet" for more Co$ mouthpieces to half-ass admit what we've already known even before Matt and Trey released it upon the masses that never cared enough to look it up themselves, or is Danos treading on thin ice with the "church" for even commenting on X-E-M-U?

And sorry if my words read as clear as mud. I just took my nightly entheta doomsday pills, and have a hard time proofreading my ramblings.


I would agree that the xenu stuff is more mythos than anything usefull as process or belief.

The real core of the ot 3 stuff is the stuff about "body thetans", or other beings or souls that you are connected to telepathicly.

That is the belief and important part.

The space opera stuff is all through the books of scientology. You can walk into any scientology org or mission and buy books with extensive mention of space opera stuff or even at the public library. See History of Man or Creation of Human ability if you want to read all the basics of the OT levels from the story aspect. Other easily available books discuss the mechanics of the ot levels. There is really little that in confidential.

alex
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