Message from the Church of Scientology International

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guardianofthetubes

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:18 am

I still don't believe its really from the CoS, because there are a couple of things that aren't right, and email can be easily hacked. It was a nice try, but real Scientologists follow the tech last time I checked.

I'll believe it if you post a photo of David Miscavige holding up todays newspaper.
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larfalot

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:21 am

If someone has the time and inclination, could you please explain what's out-tech about the message?
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RLSteve

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:40 am

guardianofthetubes wrote:I still don't believe its really from the CoS, because there are a couple of things that aren't right, and email can be easily hacked. It was a nice try, but real Scientologists follow the tech last time I checked.


Oh? Is that why Flag has OT VIIs get sec checked every six months despite C/S Series 73RB that explains when you would sec check an OT VII and when you wouldn't?
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guardianofthetubes

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:49 am

RLSteve wrote:
guardianofthetubes wrote:I still don't believe its really from the CoS, because there are a couple of things that aren't right, and email can be easily hacked. It was a nice try, but real Scientologists follow the tech last time I checked.


Oh? Is that why Flag has OT VIIs get sec checked every six months despite C/S Series 73RB that explains when you would sec check an OT VII and when you wouldn't?


Good point.
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Grundy

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:05 am

RLSteve wrote:
ChurchOfScientologyInt wrote:By the way, I moved this thread to the General Chatter section, the reason being that your post is not defending Scientology or the Church. General Chatter is also a busier category, so I think more people are likely to see your post in this category than the other categories.


Thanks Steve.

The one that originally was in general chatter was moved to the Vault as being the same post over and over. But leaving it shadowed does the trick as well.

Uncle Grundy
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anonypanda

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:06 am

I just got my lulz for the day. Seems like a troll tbh, but i'm no expert.

But anyway, I will grace them with a reply:

Anonymous has no leaders. I don't know where you've gotten the bizarre notion that we do. It is a collective where the generally consensus determines the direction of the movement.

If someone has verifiably done anything illegal then by all means call the police and send them to jail. But don't waste society's time and money on frivolous lawsuits and swat teams to counter peaceful protestors.

If you well and truly had nothing to hide you would make yourselves transparent enough so that anyone could seriously independently verify the truth of their allegations. Such as with Anonymous: all our forums are public and most do not even require registration to post in. You know well we did not send you anthrax or bomb threats. You surely monitor our websites and IRC chat 24/7 and have reached this conclusion yourselves.

While sending garbage letters such as above is perfetly legal for you to do you must realize that it simply makes you look bad. Because it is very easy to verify your statements as false. Can you reference a single forum post or even a single user comment on IRC saying anything about bomb or death threats or anthrax for that matter? Indeed you cannot. We on the other hand have everything from documents to first hand witness accounts about your crimes.

Although I appreciate the lulz your letters provide us - please concentrate on trying to difinitively disproving our accusations instead of trying to attack the attacker. If you can I certainly will be a critic no more.

Yours truly,
Anonyous

ps. Please private message me one of those cease and decist terrorist letters. They are a bit of a medal of honour now among us anonymous. I'd like to get onto the next SP level.
Last edited by anonypanda on Tue Apr 01, 2008 5:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
Far east Anonymous.

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我们不会原谅
我们不会忘记
预期我们
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everfree

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 5:07 am

If this is real and not coming from a spoofed email, it's a significant event. I know some of the canned message probably doesn't sit well with some, but looking at it from a CofS standpoint they are being remarkably tolerant and civil.

Remember, these are people who have been carefully trained to believe that critics of Scn are criminals and that non-scientologists are "raw meat" and "wogs", whereas they have the only hope for the survival of the entire universe which we are thought to be attacking.

Their past behavior on critical message boards has been to try to have them removed, flood them with spam, threaten ISPs, yada yada yada. A missive as softly spoken (to them) as this is quite a breakthrough, even if it is canned. At least the possibility that not all anon are terrorists is considered! ;-) not to mention an affirmation of the right to peacefully protest.

A couple things to take from this event. If real, it's not every day that you have a chance to talk directly to someone in any way associated with even a middle management level org like CSI. Make the most of it by trying to correct some obvious misconceptions (like anon having leaders).

To facilitate that, I'd urge you all to try to keep your communication as civil as you can. It's easier to accept that way.

Imo, many anon did get off on the wrong foot with the ddos attacks, black faxes, and such but very quickly corrected that and adopted more productive tactics such as the protests and seem diligent in policing themselves against such things.

Maybe if any one reading this did do anything like send a black fax they could send an apology for it. Try to take the moral high road in any way you can. That would undoubtedly be far more likely to get a scnist to stop and think than even a protest would be.

I became a critic of CofS because I was sick of the hurt that CofS causes people in their supposed quest for a better world. I don't want Scnists to be hurt or afraid of anon, nor do I want to see any anon hurt by CofS. So maybe we could use this opportunity to try just talking and explaining our views as directly and without upset (called "HE&R" in Scn).

Mr. CSI person, whatever Anon may or may not have done, it is pale compared to what I've seen Scnists do to each other: the purple faced seniors ripping into their cowed juniors; hungry, destitute staff; pressured abortions of SO members; control through threat of declare and disconnection; Superpower regges taking the last of grannies retirement money; security watches... you've seen them, you can't have avoided them. They've been ongoing and unchanged for a long time.

Those are the reasons CofS gets protested, and rightly so: people of good tend to find such things appalling. Isn't it about time you and every other Scnist finally took some responsibility for their organization and did something about it?

Everfree
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Tet

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 6:30 am

Re: Message from the Church of Scientology International

ChurchOfScientologyInt wrote: a package simulating a bomb was delivered by a man wearing an Anonymous mask—and he said it was from Anonymous;


Was that the package that the CoS wasted police time by getting the bomb squad to water spray a wrapped box that turned out to be filled with confetti and candy with a note saying "Sorry we couldn't make it, Happy Valentine's Day from Anonymous"? Those bastards! We got to stop them before they send candy to us all! Next thing you know they'll be randomly saying Happy Valentine's Day to defenseless old ladies in the street!
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Tru2form

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:00 am

Dear ChurchofScientologyInt,

Thanks for writing. Everyone else has already said what I may have said, except for the fact that this really isn't an Anonymous message board. There are quite a few anon on here, and they are welcome, as you are welcome as long as they, and you, follow the rules of the board, which can be found here:

http://exscientologykids.com/eskforums/ ... ic.php?t=2

I'm moving this thread (yet again, sorry) to the activism section, as that's where it belongs.

Thanks.
Us rabbits? DO something? - Wind in the Willows
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leereyno

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:10 pm

Why is it that anonymous has its very own lingo (lulz, scifags, etc) just like the cult does (sp, pts, clear)?

Is it so hard for anon members to use standard english so that you don't look like a group of angry teenagers?
Scientology: Proof that evil is not merely the absence of good.
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MrMarcab

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:40 pm

This thread should be moved to the Threats and Harrasment board because it contains legal threats without evidence supporting it. A majority of the accusations made in the original post were found false after the attempted injunction made by The Corporation of Scientology to obtain a restraining order against Anonymous. Also, charges were brought up against the CoS because of the evidence presented for the restraining order to prevent the Clearwater, FL protests on 3/15.

Please bring actual evidence if you actually wish to be taken seriously on this forum. You don't see any of us making accusations without some kind of reasoning behind it.

Scientology Injunction (Legal Document) http://rapidshare.com/files/104142594/Scientologyinjunction.pdf.html


The rejection of said injunction (News Article) http://blogs.tampabay.com/breakingnews/2008/03/second-scientol.html
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Grundy

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:41 pm

MrMarcab, Kendra, the owner of the board, and the head high-honcho, felt it should be here.

So, here it stays ....

Although it is shadowed in the Threats Harrassment I believe...
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MrMarcab

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Post Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:45 pm

thats good enough for me. thanks.
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ImOut

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Post Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:16 am

Re: Message from the Church of Scientology International

ChurchOfScientologyInt wrote:We want innocent members of Anonymous to know that they are being unwittingly duped by the leaders of Anonymous.
Church of Scientology
International
March 31, 2008"


Just like Anonymous wants "innocent members of the CofS to know that they are being unwittingly duped by the leaders of Scientology".

I do NOT believe for one minute that anonymous has done anything illegal. But I do KNOW that the CofS has on more than one occasion.
Isn't it grand to be out!
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ImOut

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Post Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:21 am

guardianofthetubes wrote:And the CoS already knows the leaders of anonymous - psychiatrists, psychologists, the German Secret Service, the FBI, the NSA, the KKK, the Nazis, the Communists, the Zionists, the IRS...

(edited by RLSteve to remove OT III terms)


The IRS isn't a leader of anonymous - they are running the CofS. Look at the corporation papers in the state of California. One of the people on record is an ex-IRS head (top person).
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Snoware

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Post Wed Apr 02, 2008 3:24 am

Re: Message from the Church of Scientology International

ChurchOfScientologyInt wrote:"..... The bomb threats, death threats, simulated anthrax attacks, the denial of service attacks, the vandalism at Church facilities and pornographic and racist communications sent daily to our churches are illegal acts of individuals who say they are part of Anonymous. .......


I welcome the opportunity to discuss issues with you.

Regarding Anonymous.

The denial of service attacks were committed by the original chan members of Anonymous. This act has been admitted and was ill-advised but it was part of their original culture. Since then Anonymous has grown to include the general public. I am a general public Anonymous and its been over 25 years since I was a teenager. Chan Anonymous are young. The expanded Anonymous is every age.

From the multiple pictures and videos of your buildings, showing exterior video surveillance cameras, as well as the ever present scientology staff taking pictures of everything that moves outside your buildings adding to that the security and PI staff you cannot deny that your buildings are extremely secure. It is simply not possible to approach your buildings in a mask without being photographed. If someone did approach your buildings, your security would have been on top of it immediately. Why would your security staff not have followed the alleged terrorist while contacting police? Where are the pictures and video?

Do you deny that LRH said, "If attacked on some vulnerable point by anyone or anything or any organization, always find or manufacture enough threat against them to cause them to sue for peace."

The bomb threats, the powder letters, they are simply manufactured evidence created in the spirit of LRH's words by the Church of Scientology.

You can't deny that you have manufactured evidence. If you failed to do so, you would be ignoring LRH's directives. Is that not some kind of Scientology sin?

If you received threatening faxes, did you have police investigate the phone numbers of the senders? If you received threatening emails, how did they get by your spam filter? Would your spam filter not immediately delete any emails containing inappropriate content? Why would these emails even reach anyone's eyes? Pornographic spam is not new and anyone with children in the house would have it blocked or filtered and deleted automatically.

If these events were truly threatening why have there been no arrests. Have you not turned security videos over to police? Do the police even believe you are telling them the truth?
Last edited by Snoware on Thu Apr 03, 2008 10:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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ImOut

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Post Wed Apr 02, 2008 3:28 am

Snoware,

Great response. :)
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sciostopabuse

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Post Thu Apr 03, 2008 5:16 am

Re: Message from the Church of Scientology International

WrongPlaceRightTime wrote:BE SURE TO REREAD THIS..... It has been edited for truthiness.


"truthiness". :)
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Alvin Tostig

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Post Thu Apr 03, 2008 6:40 pm

Re: Message from the Church of Scientology International

Snoware wrote:
If these events were truly threatening why have been no arrests. Have you not turned security videos over to police? Do the police even believe you are telling them the truth?


Completely awesome Snoware. Well done. I bow down to you.

I too would be very interested to know why Co$ is complaining about alleged anonymous terrorists when their Private Investigators, private Security and hundreds of security cameras monitor every person that even looks at Co$ property.

Surely Co$ has video evidence of the Anon that vandalized Co$ property and managed to deliver a phony bomb to a Co$ building.

Surely Co$ investigators and security folks followed this person to find out who they were. I hear that Co$ is EXCELLENT at following people right?

Anonymous is an open and transparent collective of like-minded folks with no organization, mebership cards or hierarchy. I am certain this concept is truly mind-blowing to Co$ with the never ending quest of advancement to the next level and belonging to the next level closer to the inner sanctum.

When Co$ admits to its wrong-doing, apologizes and changes its ways then Anonymous will disappear. But since admitting to wrong-doing, apologizing to wogs and changing the tech are all serious crimes in Co$ I don't see that happening anytime soon.

And so that is why we protest Co$ every month. See you on April 12th Co$
"Every religion has its problems and detractors, but when most EVERYONE sees that yours is a cult and a scam there just might be a real problem..."

- AnonyK23 at lulznw dot com
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anon5427

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Post Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:45 am

"You have asked why we have taken the time to harass you individually and collectively. We want you to think that there are illegal acts being committed by individuals who say they are part of, or leaders of, Anonymous. The videos we have shared with you are the videos specially created by members of the Office of Special Affairs (motto: "putting the 'special' into spying since the GO went to jail"). We really hope to convince you that they honestly, swear on our mom's lives, aren't our words. The simulated bomb threats, simulated death threats, simulated anthrax attacks, the "Al-Qaeda-like" denial of service attacks, the "alleged" vandalism at Church facilities and pornographic and racist communications we like to claim are sent daily to our churches come from the creative imaginations of individuals who when asked, will always firmly deny that they're part of the Office of Special Affairs (motto: "making Co$ intelligence a contradiction in terms, since, well back in the day"). The Church's parishioners really do have no way of knowing who committed these uninvestigated acts of violence and who is really sending daily threats—because on this, Hubbard trained us well.

The Church seeks only to eliminate and prevent future honest criticism directed against the Church. That is why we seek to vilify Anonymous and intimidate you. That is why Anonymous members are receiving letters from the Church's attorneys. We desperately, oh so desperately want to convince innocent "members" of Anonymous that they are being unwittingly duped by the "leaders" of Anonymous.

We know that most of you are peaceful individuals who understand the scope of the terrorist campaign that has been waged by the Church over the years but we will never renounce that violence or think twice about whether we truly want to be associated with a group that engages in these kinds of activities.

The Church loves to claim that it respects the rights of all individuals to speak freely and to worship freely. Laughable? Maybe, but shit, it's kept working for us so far.


Church of Scientology
International
31 March 2008"

Strangely, I agree with this... :-)
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